Alright, 100% new to eve so rather than making 18 posts and spaming your nice forums with silly posts, rambling and questions i will attempt to contain them here.
So far would like to say thanks to all who have helped, got invited to DSI, and made my way over there.
(36 jumps later)
Eve is complex and still figuring out the training but fairly happy learning the learning skills till at least level 3 or 4(may stop at 3 and train some other things i want once i have a better idea what that is.)
I did the tutorial but did not get the Riffter as expected so flew around in a slasher. I have since upgraded to a breacher. Finding level one missions fairly easy with the breacher as missiles seem to almost 2 shot everything and i have 3. I also top out at 835m/s so i don't take dmg. So for training i look to upgrading to the rifter once the basher dies. I will train towards optamizing the rifter rather than basher. Mainly because that ship looks better and every one says the rifter is awsome.
Did a level 3 mission with another DSI member and doubt i am ready for that as i am very frail. I also burned through a lot of missiles in that mission.
Current fitting is
3 standard missile launchers, and an empty slot. maybe a salvager later i can toggle on and off for when collecting wrecks?
1 AB, 1 shield booster
empty slot, looking for something light, so i did not fit armour plating.
So i have some questions. I'll update this thread with more questions and experiances.
1)How does aggro work, in the joint mission the tank said he had aggro..how? can it be taken from him?
2)what is the max range for missiles? what is the best range? all it tells me is the missiles speed.
3)what missiles should i use? I seem to do good dmg but the reload time means i would not swap once somethings shields where down to armour missiles... should i fit diffrent types? currently i shoot all 3 at once.
4) should i buy a rifter?
5) should i post my api number for tips?
6) how can i help DSI? right now just running missions solo and feel a bit selfish.
thanks for reading.
So far would like to say thanks to all who have helped, got invited to DSI, and made my way over there.
(36 jumps later)
Eve is complex and still figuring out the training but fairly happy learning the learning skills till at least level 3 or 4(may stop at 3 and train some other things i want once i have a better idea what that is.)
I did the tutorial but did not get the Riffter as expected so flew around in a slasher. I have since upgraded to a breacher. Finding level one missions fairly easy with the breacher as missiles seem to almost 2 shot everything and i have 3. I also top out at 835m/s so i don't take dmg. So for training i look to upgrading to the rifter once the basher dies. I will train towards optamizing the rifter rather than basher. Mainly because that ship looks better and every one says the rifter is awsome.
Did a level 3 mission with another DSI member and doubt i am ready for that as i am very frail. I also burned through a lot of missiles in that mission.
Current fitting is
3 standard missile launchers, and an empty slot. maybe a salvager later i can toggle on and off for when collecting wrecks?
1 AB, 1 shield booster
empty slot, looking for something light, so i did not fit armour plating.
So i have some questions. I'll update this thread with more questions and experiances.
1)How does aggro work, in the joint mission the tank said he had aggro..how? can it be taken from him?
2)what is the max range for missiles? what is the best range? all it tells me is the missiles speed.
3)what missiles should i use? I seem to do good dmg but the reload time means i would not swap once somethings shields where down to armour missiles... should i fit diffrent types? currently i shoot all 3 at once.
4) should i buy a rifter?
5) should i post my api number for tips?
6) how can i help DSI? right now just running missions solo and feel a bit selfish.
thanks for reading.
1) Once a rat (NPC pirate) locks onto someone it doesn't let go. The only way aggro would shift is if they were blown up or warped out, breaking the lock and causing the rat to look for a new target to lock on.
2) Missile range varies based on the type of missile and your skills. There are two stats to look at, the velocity of the missile and the maximum flight time. Flight time X Velocity = Range. The easiest way to calculate the range with your skills is just to use this tool: http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=548883. Eve Fitting Tool. You put in your limited API and it will load your skills into the program. Then you can fit out ships and it will show you the stats, such as missile range.
3) Most rats are weak to one particular damage type regardless of whether its their shield or armor (with a secondary one that are slightly less weaker too). You need to pick the missile with the right damage type for the right rat. Guristas are weak to Kinetic / Thermal, Serpentis weak to Kinetic / Thermal, Angels weak to Explosive / Kinetic, Blood Raiders weak to EM / Thermal.
4) A slasher is a destroyer right? That's the best for Level 1 missions. You'll need a cruiser to do Level 2 missions.
5) You don't need to post your API.
6) Learning the game is the best help right now. Your usefulness increases exponentially with your skill and your knowledge of the game. Just pipe up in chat, lend a hand when you can, otherwise just get a handle on the game.
2) Missile range varies based on the type of missile and your skills. There are two stats to look at, the velocity of the missile and the maximum flight time. Flight time X Velocity = Range. The easiest way to calculate the range with your skills is just to use this tool: http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=548883. Eve Fitting Tool. You put in your limited API and it will load your skills into the program. Then you can fit out ships and it will show you the stats, such as missile range.
3) Most rats are weak to one particular damage type regardless of whether its their shield or armor (with a secondary one that are slightly less weaker too). You need to pick the missile with the right damage type for the right rat. Guristas are weak to Kinetic / Thermal, Serpentis weak to Kinetic / Thermal, Angels weak to Explosive / Kinetic, Blood Raiders weak to EM / Thermal.
4) A slasher is a destroyer right? That's the best for Level 1 missions. You'll need a cruiser to do Level 2 missions.
5) You don't need to post your API.
6) Learning the game is the best help right now. Your usefulness increases exponentially with your skill and your knowledge of the game. Just pipe up in chat, lend a hand when you can, otherwise just get a handle on the game.
in response to 6...in otherwords I get increasing useless being that it's me but I'm sure you'll learn the game 
I've sent a couple of people my API just so they can help me with some skill planning but since that allows them to see your wallet and stuff, it's not recommended to hand that out openly.
I've sent a couple of people my API just so they can help me with some skill planning but since that allows them to see your wallet and stuff, it's not recommended to hand that out openly. Slahser was a frigate, but i had to sell for the move to the DSI home base.
I only have a Breacher Currently.
Believe i only have frigates as it is my 3ed day.
I only have a Breacher Currently.
Believe i only have frigates as it is my 3ed day.
what's your toon in game named?
Morgals
Also about the frigates i believe i will be moving to a riffter the instant my breacher is not up to a given task. till then no need to change as it can run mission fine.
I have not even looked at cruisers yet. Unsure it is wise for me to look that far, and unsure what i would even be looking at. Mimnitar cruisers seem a little meh compared to assault frigates.
one thing is, I am finding it hard to match the time not plaing to skills I need to train.
So i work for 5hours but seems the skills i want to train take 1h. seems like a lot of wasted time.
Or a skill takes 12hours but i'll be on in 4h.
Eve mon is nice but only if i could constantly log on to adjust my training.
I'll try that fitting tool, although the default interface is fairly good at telling me what i can't do.
Also about the frigates i believe i will be moving to a riffter the instant my breacher is not up to a given task. till then no need to change as it can run mission fine.
I have not even looked at cruisers yet. Unsure it is wise for me to look that far, and unsure what i would even be looking at. Mimnitar cruisers seem a little meh compared to assault frigates.
one thing is, I am finding it hard to match the time not plaing to skills I need to train.
So i work for 5hours but seems the skills i want to train take 1h. seems like a lot of wasted time.
Or a skill takes 12hours but i'll be on in 4h.
Eve mon is nice but only if i could constantly log on to adjust my training.
I'll try that fitting tool, although the default interface is fairly good at telling me what i can't do.
I'll be on tonight after I get home from work and spend a couple hours with the wife and baby. Then I can help you and answer questions.
What I would suggest for training skills is this:
When you know you are going to be gone for a while and don't want to have wasted time where you aren't training something... pick something that takes a long time (like a learning skill) start training it. When you get home, select a skill you want to train up while you are playing like one of the 1hr skills. Progress trained in the learning skill (or what ever skill you switched from) gets saved and you start back at the same spot.
Example, before I goto sleep tonight, I'll probably pick a 5 day skill like Engineering V. When I wake up and log in... it will have like say maybe 10% trained... then i'll select some 3-5 hr skill to train while i'm at the computer.... once it's done... i can switch back to the Engineering V and training picks back up at the 10% it left off at.
What I would suggest for training skills is this:
When you know you are going to be gone for a while and don't want to have wasted time where you aren't training something... pick something that takes a long time (like a learning skill) start training it. When you get home, select a skill you want to train up while you are playing like one of the 1hr skills. Progress trained in the learning skill (or what ever skill you switched from) gets saved and you start back at the same spot.
Example, before I goto sleep tonight, I'll probably pick a 5 day skill like Engineering V. When I wake up and log in... it will have like say maybe 10% trained... then i'll select some 3-5 hr skill to train while i'm at the computer.... once it's done... i can switch back to the Engineering V and training picks back up at the 10% it left off at.
DSI supplies frigates and cruisers I believe. You should be able to go all those you need to be able to learn the game. Anything they don't supply I can. I make ships myself, so if you need anything, just let me know and I'll pop one on the cooker for you.
- Zucce -
- Zucce -
well "In EVE a pilot should never pilot a ship he can't afford to lose."
So unsure if i want to take out ships provided by the corp.
Once i get my rifter I'll be fairly happy for a bit. I know very little about minmitar cruisers.
Thats what i have been doing for skills, it is just there is a lot of skills and no idea what to train first. So i have been using this as a guide.
http://wiki.eveonline.com/wiki/Rifter_%28Guide%29
obvously this is what i work on besides the learning skills. Working on getting those up to level 3 as a fast as possible.
But once there using the rifter well will be my next goal. Unsure if this is wise and i should be looking at cruisers and getting there as fast as possible.
Mainly looking for mission running and pvp, maybe ratting. could mine some I suppose while providing security(one minor modual one the rifter haha)
So unsure if i want to take out ships provided by the corp.
Once i get my rifter I'll be fairly happy for a bit. I know very little about minmitar cruisers.
Thats what i have been doing for skills, it is just there is a lot of skills and no idea what to train first. So i have been using this as a guide.
http://wiki.eveonline.com/wiki/Rifter_%28Guide%29
obvously this is what i work on besides the learning skills. Working on getting those up to level 3 as a fast as possible.
But once there using the rifter well will be my next goal. Unsure if this is wise and i should be looking at cruisers and getting there as fast as possible.
Mainly looking for mission running and pvp, maybe ratting. could mine some I suppose while providing security(one minor modual one the rifter haha)
Thats a great guide. And a worthy starter goal, I was just saying to Zucce today that rifters make ideal starter pvp ships.
That guide is just the thing for him.
That guide is just the thing for him.
I low sec PvP in rifters.
The thing about getting the ships from DSI or from me is we can afford the loss. We give them out. You could blow up in 30 caracals a day and I would hardly feel the dent, while if you saved up for one at your time in game, it would be a big loss. I suggest taking the better ships from corp if you can use them. It helps a lot with learning the game.
And I'll go read that guide as well Aepod.
- Zucce -
And I'll go read that guide as well Aepod.
- Zucce -
Oh, well already bought my own Rifter.
I also am unsure if I like it for the missions but will have to see.
I also bought my own Burst for mining but can only equip 2 lasers.
I did this since most of the corp seems to be on mining missions and i would like to join in. Will probably still train combat skill though.
I also am unsure if I like it for the missions but will have to see.
I also bought my own Burst for mining but can only equip 2 lasers.
I did this since most of the corp seems to be on mining missions and i would like to join in. Will probably still train combat skill though.
id recomend flying around ina frig a bit longer until you get more of a hang on things. however if you can fly a crusier id say bring that along with other members for a lv 3 mission as they can be useful in firesupport etc.
im away atm but id be more than willing to help next week with flying wing cover for ya
im away atm but id be more than willing to help next week with flying wing cover for ya
Okay well I can train to fly them as i have frigates at 4, and spaceship command at 3.
SO was looking at the rupture as well, may only bring it out for group missions and out fit it with arties to sit back and shoot....not really sure
Could use some advice on what to train/fit for the rupture and when i should move to it.
SO was looking at the rupture as well, may only bring it out for group missions and out fit it with arties to sit back and shoot....not really sure
Could use some advice on what to train/fit for the rupture and when i should move to it.
I would recommend perusing the "ships & modules" forum on the EVE forums. There's a directory at the beginning with links to setups for various ships, or you can scroll through the postings to see if any match what you are looking for.
The thing about EVE is there a HUGE amount of information, lots of varying opinions, and very few "right" answers. It would be difficult for us to give you all the information you'll want and/or need. The EVE forums are a great source of information. You really have to mine the entire community to get sufficient information.
For ship fittings, there are basic principles such as what is long range, what is short range, tank or speed, armor tank or shield tank. Beyond that there's a wide range of possibilities. There's not necessarily one setup, and a lot of it is just experimenting and figuring out what you think works for you.
The thing about EVE is there a HUGE amount of information, lots of varying opinions, and very few "right" answers. It would be difficult for us to give you all the information you'll want and/or need. The EVE forums are a great source of information. You really have to mine the entire community to get sufficient information.
For ship fittings, there are basic principles such as what is long range, what is short range, tank or speed, armor tank or shield tank. Beyond that there's a wide range of possibilities. There's not necessarily one setup, and a lot of it is just experimenting and figuring out what you think works for you.
Aye, lots of info, lots of it contradicting.
I have an over all plan and a short term plan.
Cruiser-rupture
then
Hurricane
after that maelstrom but thats a long ways off.
Short term i just bought a destroyer to out fit for salvage. Training up for savagers and tractor beams. Using a thrasher with it's 8 high slots.
After that only need a few skills for cruisers
mainly cruisers 3
med projectile turrets
high speed
and hull upgrades
estimated time 4-5 days depending how efficient i am with down time.
will keep upgrading after that but i should be able to pilot one well after that. After a bit will move onto training the hurricane abilities. don't think i'll need a bigger salvager for a bit...but who knows. It can also double as a cruddy miner if i want to go on DSI ops.
I have an over all plan and a short term plan.
Cruiser-rupture
then
Hurricane
after that maelstrom but thats a long ways off.
Short term i just bought a destroyer to out fit for salvage. Training up for savagers and tractor beams. Using a thrasher with it's 8 high slots.
After that only need a few skills for cruisers
mainly cruisers 3
med projectile turrets
high speed
and hull upgrades
estimated time 4-5 days depending how efficient i am with down time.
will keep upgrading after that but i should be able to pilot one well after that. After a bit will move onto training the hurricane abilities. don't think i'll need a bigger salvager for a bit...but who knows. It can also double as a cruddy miner if i want to go on DSI ops.
Don't forget weapon support skills like motion prediction, sharpshooter, rapid firing for turrets or missile bombardment, missile projection, warhead upgrades etc for missiles. Or support skills for tanking armor/shields. Having those support skills to III or IV can really make you shine in a t1 cruiser compared to not having them.
Learning skills and implants are always a pleasure to have.
QUOTE(morgal @ Jan 23 2009, 06:06 AM)
1)How does aggro work, in the joint mission the tank said he had aggro..how? can it be taken from him?
2)what is the max range for missiles? what is the best range? all it tells me is the missiles speed.
3)what missiles should i use? I seem to do good dmg but the reload time means i would not swap once somethings shields where down to armour missiles... should i fit diffrent types? currently i shoot all 3 at once.
4) should i buy a rifter?
5) should i post my api number for tips?
6) how can i help DSI? right now just running missions solo and feel a bit selfish.
2)what is the max range for missiles? what is the best range? all it tells me is the missiles speed.
3)what missiles should i use? I seem to do good dmg but the reload time means i would not swap once somethings shields where down to armour missiles... should i fit diffrent types? currently i shoot all 3 at once.
4) should i buy a rifter?
5) should i post my api number for tips?
6) how can i help DSI? right now just running missions solo and feel a bit selfish.
Okay, some detailed answers.
1) I said I had 'aggro' because all of the enemy ships were flashing red to me. That means they had targetted and locked me. NPCs will *usually* not switch their aggression (aggro) once they've assigned it, unless their target (me) dies or warps out. Then the person they next pick is chosen by some arcane formula that nobody knows. 'rats generally have 3 ways they aggro:
a) proximity - be the first one to come close enough, and a group of rats will aggro you.
b) aggression - shoot one of a linked group of rats (even if you miss), and they'll all aggro you if they haven't already aggroed on someone else.
c) automatic - some groups of rats will automatically aggro the first pilot they see.
Note that in missions where 'waves' of rats spawn, there is almost no way to predict who they will target. This part of the game is very... odd.
2) Missile range is calculated by multiplying missile speed by missile flight time. If you look in EveMon, for example, you will see that the Bloodclaw Light Missile has a speed of 3,750m/s and a flight time of 5 secs. This gives you a base range of 18,750m. I said base, because skills can and will modify this.
3) Generally you want to look at a rat's resistances and shoot it with that. For instance, Blood Raiders have poor EM and Thermal resistances. So when fighting them, use either Sabertooth (EM) or Flameburst (Thermal) light missiles.
4) Rifter? Good little frigate. It's a nice stepping stone to destroyer/cruiser. It's also one of the best T1 Minmatar frigates. Sure, go ahead.
Why fly a cheap frigate if you can fly a good one? (the money not being an issue)5) You're better off just saying what you want to pursue with your character and then listening to the results. But post away. *shrug*
6) Running missions means you are building faction (hopefully with Khanid) and making money. The corp has a 20% tax rate, so 20% of your mission profits are going straight to the corp. This means you ARE helping the corp. Also, learning and growing to be a better, stronger pilot helps us. Believe me, you do help. Heck, even salvaging (a VERY lucrative skill to have) is very helpful - and you don't need barely any skills to do it. Get a salvage destroyer, or a hauler, and you can contribute from day one. But even having your frigate along in L4 missions (assuming you survive) is helpful - you can kill the annoying frigates, for instance.
Trust me, even 'noobs' can be helpful in Eve. I'm glad to have you along.
EDIT: Oh, one more thing! You REALLY want to train the basic learning skills to 4 asap. At Level 4, they unlock the advanced learning skills, and you can quickly train those to three as well.
To give you perspective: with a full rack of +4 implants, and all basic learning to 5 and advanced learning to 4, I have attributes all around 22. This gives me roughly 2000sp per hour, or about 1.5 million sp per month. A rank 1 skill training time from L3 to L4 for me is 18 hours. If I didn't have these learning skills, that could easily be over a day. I remember when training a rank 1 skill from level 4 to level 5 took more than a week. Now it barely takes four days.
Oh for sure i will be in the cruiser training phase for a while.
I do plan on doing the learning skill but not until i have my cruiser to a place where i am happy with. Once there i feel i can contribute enough and do enough solo to spend some time training more learning skills.
As for the combat skills, i already have most of those to a decent level. Some right out out of the box being a special forces character. I also trained others like motion prediction to help the rifter. I am still undecided what skill to train for the cruiser but sure some of those will be present.
Only looking at tier 1 cruiser guns so not a fully equiped/trained cruiser just decent. I also have +3 implants.
I am still debating how to out fit my rupture, so will be looking at builds. It is hard to use battle clinic and such since most of the builds are for fully trained characters not growing one's. Not intrested in having the best cruiser as that will take time. One of my main motivations for a cruiser is joint op's. yes my rifter is awsome and can solo missions while looking cool but i felt it was lacking in a few ways. For joint op's my auto cannon fit rifter simply could not get close neough fast enough. With the large ships engaging targets at far range and me not being able to lock targets untill 24km, and then having to close within 1000m before the auto cannons could do real dmg. the missle launcher helped. Felt like maybe my missle fitted breacher would not have been more help due to it's longer range.
While i could kill the frigates by the time I flew at 1010m/s at them, locked them, painted them, webed them and did some dmg to them the larger ship's drones would have killed one. So while i would claim 1-2 kills or dmg equivilant to 2 kills they would kill the remaing 10. I also suffered from going towards a target, get it locked....and then it blows up. So most of my time was spent not doing dmg but moving to get in range. So I may bring the breacher next time.
But i also feel the cruiser will do better at the anti frigate role as well as bringin more firepower for other targets. Unless i can skip right to the huricane
in writing this i believe i will update my breacher, it may perform better in these group runs while my rifter will remain my main ship for solo or smaller op's.
although i did like rifter tanking the larger ships, felt good to have agroo from 2-3 of the larger ships right when our tank was worried about his tank and not able to fire due to active tanking. I liked that, but it's playing with fire as one hit would hurt a lot. I got hit once and it took my shield right off and my amrour to half. was fun though.
I do plan on doing the learning skill but not until i have my cruiser to a place where i am happy with. Once there i feel i can contribute enough and do enough solo to spend some time training more learning skills.
As for the combat skills, i already have most of those to a decent level. Some right out out of the box being a special forces character. I also trained others like motion prediction to help the rifter. I am still undecided what skill to train for the cruiser but sure some of those will be present.
Only looking at tier 1 cruiser guns so not a fully equiped/trained cruiser just decent. I also have +3 implants.
I am still debating how to out fit my rupture, so will be looking at builds. It is hard to use battle clinic and such since most of the builds are for fully trained characters not growing one's. Not intrested in having the best cruiser as that will take time. One of my main motivations for a cruiser is joint op's. yes my rifter is awsome and can solo missions while looking cool but i felt it was lacking in a few ways. For joint op's my auto cannon fit rifter simply could not get close neough fast enough. With the large ships engaging targets at far range and me not being able to lock targets untill 24km, and then having to close within 1000m before the auto cannons could do real dmg. the missle launcher helped. Felt like maybe my missle fitted breacher would not have been more help due to it's longer range.
While i could kill the frigates by the time I flew at 1010m/s at them, locked them, painted them, webed them and did some dmg to them the larger ship's drones would have killed one. So while i would claim 1-2 kills or dmg equivilant to 2 kills they would kill the remaing 10. I also suffered from going towards a target, get it locked....and then it blows up. So most of my time was spent not doing dmg but moving to get in range. So I may bring the breacher next time.
But i also feel the cruiser will do better at the anti frigate role as well as bringin more firepower for other targets. Unless i can skip right to the huricane
in writing this i believe i will update my breacher, it may perform better in these group runs while my rifter will remain my main ship for solo or smaller op's.
although i did like rifter tanking the larger ships, felt good to have agroo from 2-3 of the larger ships right when our tank was worried about his tank and not able to fire due to active tanking. I liked that, but it's playing with fire as one hit would hurt a lot. I got hit once and it took my shield right off and my amrour to half. was fun though.
QUOTE(ChronoSphere @ Jan 26 2009, 09:55 AM)
Don't forget weapon support skills like motion prediction, sharpshooter, rapid firing for turrets or missile bombardment, missile projection, warhead upgrades etc for missiles. Or support skills for tanking armor/shields. Having those support skills to III or IV can really make you shine in a t1 cruiser compared to not having them.
in addition if you are going for a rupture/artillery platform i HIGHLY recommend motion prediction and rapid fire. arties are slow to track and shoot but boy do they land a good hit. i think they have the highest damage multiplier of any weapon class; which is of course offset by a slow rof and poor tracking.
Nice as that also buffs my rifter....i like that.
I do have one question, i bought a thrasher(destroyer) for salvage and it has 8 highslots.
for salvage thats great but 8 high slots....thats a lot of guns.
Why are cruisers considered better when the Rupture only has 6 slots. cruiser are considered a better pogression from frigates. Couldn't the destroyer do more dmg? Or is it because cruisers tank better with more low/mid slots. Just visions of a destroyer with 8 missle launchers is nice. and thats my salvage boat.
Would it ever be advisable to skip cruisers and go for the battle cruiser huricane?
I do have one question, i bought a thrasher(destroyer) for salvage and it has 8 highslots.
for salvage thats great but 8 high slots....thats a lot of guns.
Why are cruisers considered better when the Rupture only has 6 slots. cruiser are considered a better pogression from frigates. Couldn't the destroyer do more dmg? Or is it because cruisers tank better with more low/mid slots. Just visions of a destroyer with 8 missle launchers is nice. and thats my salvage boat.
Would it ever be advisable to skip cruisers and go for the battle cruiser huricane?
Cruisers fit medium guns, destroyers fit small guns. Bigger guns mean more damage per gun. Battlecruisers fit medium guns, battleships fit large guns. Bigger guns also have longer range. Destroyers also have a penalty to refire rate to offset their DPS a little, but ultimately its the medium guns that make the big difference between a destroyer and cruiser in terms of DPS.
Long range is pretty important for missions in general, either for group ops or as your DPS increases. A lot of time is wasted simply powering to within range of a ship. It's rare that short range is useful in a mission.
A cruiser with medium guns will have a lot of DPS so you'll be plowing through missions faster and will definitely want the range to expedite the destruction.
Long range is pretty important for missions in general, either for group ops or as your DPS increases. A lot of time is wasted simply powering to within range of a ship. It's rare that short range is useful in a mission.
A cruiser with medium guns will have a lot of DPS so you'll be plowing through missions faster and will definitely want the range to expedite the destruction.
Yep. Remember that this game does have a lot of linear progression to how things work. For instance (oversimplifying):
Small guns - 1 damage, 1 range, 1 cap used, 1 grid to fit, can hit size 1 or larger easily
Medium guns - 2 damage, 2 range, 10 cap, 10 grid to fit, can hit size 2 or larger easily
Large guns - 4 damage, 4 range, 100 cap, 100 grid, can hit size 4 or larger easily
Now, using this same model, understand that:
(FF)Frigates: 2-4 gun slots, 100 cap, 5 grid, size 1
(CR)Cruisers: 3-5 gun slots, 1000 cap, 60 grid, size 2
(BB)Battleships: 6-8 gun slots, 10000 cap, 1000 grid, size 4
Oversimplified, but I think an adequate example. Now, you asked about destroyers?
(DD)Destroyers: 6-8 gun slots, 200 cap, 10 grid, size 1.5, ROF penalty
(BC)Battlecruisers: 6-8 gun slots, 2000 cap, 120 grid, size 3
Notice the advantage/disadvantage? When you go to a DD/BC, you keep the same size guns as the next smaller ship, you get more of them, but as a consequence you are also more of a target to larger ships. A battleship can hit a size 1.5 ship MUCH easier with its large guns than a size 1 ship. This ties into the whole Signature stat of ships.
Small guns - 1 damage, 1 range, 1 cap used, 1 grid to fit, can hit size 1 or larger easily
Medium guns - 2 damage, 2 range, 10 cap, 10 grid to fit, can hit size 2 or larger easily
Large guns - 4 damage, 4 range, 100 cap, 100 grid, can hit size 4 or larger easily
Now, using this same model, understand that:
(FF)Frigates: 2-4 gun slots, 100 cap, 5 grid, size 1
(CR)Cruisers: 3-5 gun slots, 1000 cap, 60 grid, size 2
(BB)Battleships: 6-8 gun slots, 10000 cap, 1000 grid, size 4
Oversimplified, but I think an adequate example. Now, you asked about destroyers?
(DD)Destroyers: 6-8 gun slots, 200 cap, 10 grid, size 1.5, ROF penalty
(BC)Battlecruisers: 6-8 gun slots, 2000 cap, 120 grid, size 3
Notice the advantage/disadvantage? When you go to a DD/BC, you keep the same size guns as the next smaller ship, you get more of them, but as a consequence you are also more of a target to larger ships. A battleship can hit a size 1.5 ship MUCH easier with its large guns than a size 1 ship. This ties into the whole Signature stat of ships.
You should make a goal for your character. This will help you decide what ship to ultimately shoot for. Would you prefer to fly around in battleship all the time, or smaller ships? If you like missions, they can be done in all kinds of ships including level 4s. Once you have an overall goal, it will be easier to figure out the skills needed to reach it.
Aye, a long term goal?
The maelstrom, That looks awsome!
But to be honest i can see going tech 2 outfit on the huricane because it is cheaper and more expendable. I also have lots of ship to chose from from there, with tier 2 cruisers also sharing the same skills and outfitting. i like being fast, so that is also a factor. So my real goal is the huricane well piloted.
After that i really don't know, i will have to experiance more of the game and more pvp before I decide. But no need to rush as i have lots of growing to do.
I also bought a Rupture, so I flew to Amar to buy items to out fit it.
I learned some things, mainly what not to do.
I looked at eve mon and the battle clinic builds and chose "cheap level 2 runner" as it needed me to train almost nothing, but had auto cannons.
I thought i wanted artillary because range is good. Well I didn't notice artillary took 200 power to autocannons 100. So i bought 4-720 scout artillary cannons...then couldn't fit them. I could only fit 3. ^$$$# *&%
I also learned that just because i can fit a heavy missile launcher does not mean i can use it...you need the skill on the missiles... %^#* *&%
So i learned to use the E fit..found a build i could use. It's less than ideal because i chose 4x 620 scout artillary guns, the missiles where replaced with a salvager and tractor beam. For solo mission running.
I also bought the cheapest items of what i needed....the cheep ones 7 jumps away.
I figured it was not so bad as 7 jumps is not bad and the one with 6 jumps must be on the way....
not 6 jumps one way, then 13 the other way, then 14 in yet another way...
Took me all night to collect my items.....next time i'll look at where they are.
So, finally have my rupture ready to go....my slow rupture....got so use to my 1015m/s rifter and it's 6au warp speed....
So here is hoping i actually get to shoot something.
Also for my long term plan...i have 10-11 days left on the Trial, I will keep going in eve as i am enjoying it.
But have surgery on the 12th, so i will not be back till after then and i will subscribe then...almost like a planned it.
So will be looking for something really long to train. Hope to only be out for 5 or so days...but who knows.
The maelstrom, That looks awsome!
But to be honest i can see going tech 2 outfit on the huricane because it is cheaper and more expendable. I also have lots of ship to chose from from there, with tier 2 cruisers also sharing the same skills and outfitting. i like being fast, so that is also a factor. So my real goal is the huricane well piloted.
After that i really don't know, i will have to experiance more of the game and more pvp before I decide. But no need to rush as i have lots of growing to do.
I also bought a Rupture, so I flew to Amar to buy items to out fit it.
I learned some things, mainly what not to do.
I looked at eve mon and the battle clinic builds and chose "cheap level 2 runner" as it needed me to train almost nothing, but had auto cannons.
I thought i wanted artillary because range is good. Well I didn't notice artillary took 200 power to autocannons 100. So i bought 4-720 scout artillary cannons...then couldn't fit them. I could only fit 3. ^$$$# *&%
I also learned that just because i can fit a heavy missile launcher does not mean i can use it...you need the skill on the missiles... %^#* *&%
So i learned to use the E fit..found a build i could use. It's less than ideal because i chose 4x 620 scout artillary guns, the missiles where replaced with a salvager and tractor beam. For solo mission running.
I also bought the cheapest items of what i needed....the cheep ones 7 jumps away.
I figured it was not so bad as 7 jumps is not bad and the one with 6 jumps must be on the way....
not 6 jumps one way, then 13 the other way, then 14 in yet another way...
Took me all night to collect my items.....next time i'll look at where they are.
So, finally have my rupture ready to go....my slow rupture....got so use to my 1015m/s rifter and it's 6au warp speed....
So here is hoping i actually get to shoot something.
Also for my long term plan...i have 10-11 days left on the Trial, I will keep going in eve as i am enjoying it.
But have surgery on the 12th, so i will not be back till after then and i will subscribe then...almost like a planned it
.So will be looking for something really long to train. Hope to only be out for 5 or so days...but who knows.
My understanding is that once your account expires your skill will only train for three days before it is automatically stopped.
It used to be that skills continued training even if your account expired for however long the skill had left. But they fixed that.
Now I believe there's a three day grace period for people who use game time cards and whatnot because their accounts will often lapse before they get a new time card.
It used to be that skills continued training even if your account expired for however long the skill had left. But they fixed that.
Now I believe there's a three day grace period for people who use game time cards and whatnot because their accounts will often lapse before they get a new time card.
QUOTE(ChronoSphere @ Jan 26 2009, 08:55 AM)
Don't forget weapon support skills like motion prediction, sharpshooter, rapid firing for turrets or missile bombardment, missile projection, warhead upgrades etc for missiles.
Warhead upgrade skill.
Does it make your missiles do more damage or is it one of those skills that allow you to modify your ammo?
Increases missile damage. Check the showinfo on a skill - it'll tell you what it affects.
Small gains on warhead upgrades (2% per level), compared to training for example the battlecruiser skill, for a heavy missle on a drake which would give you 5% per skill level on kinetic damage. Or 5% fire rate per level on a raven for the battleship skill.
In other words there are better skills to spend time on, although training it to 2 or 3 or something is certainly worth it, going much past that would be a little bit of a time sink.
In other words there are better skills to spend time on, although training it to 2 or 3 or something is certainly worth it, going much past that would be a little bit of a time sink.
MR. Flipflop is back again, and doing some reading and command ships seem awsome.
The Sleipnir Seems really really nice. It also shares cruiser esk skills.
7 turrets, huge bonuses, and a kick arse tank.
It's no battle ship but not sure the battle ship is for me. Also seems more combat worthy than a BS but i don't know.
I also like it has it lets me train up my huricane as many skills transfer.
The Sleipnir Seems really really nice. It also shares cruiser esk skills.
7 turrets, huge bonuses, and a kick arse tank.
It's no battle ship but not sure the battle ship is for me. Also seems more combat worthy than a BS but i don't know.
I also like it has it lets me train up my huricane as many skills transfer.
Well, well into my rupture cruiser now, and i really really like it.
I do decent dmg practically one shotting npc frigates....if i hit.
Even at range and w/ low transversal my scout artillary is missing a lot and i see "completly misses" a lot.
I have motion prediction 3 so i'll need to find out why i am missing so much. Never mind when they get closer and i attempt to orbit them at 515m/s. I do like the long range except for the missing bit. I think i'll stick with longer range as i here bob's out fit for the huricane is a ranged gank ship and that sits well with me.
I keep looking into command ships but i may train up Battle ships...or may just stay with the cane and go for tier 2 equipment on the cane. Aperently the cane can do level 4 missions, it's just not suggested and your tank will break so it take multiple runs. I'm okay with this. I also think i will like the cane for pvp. Lots of choices.
Right now though i am traing my learning skills, i plan to get all of the tier 1's to level 4 except charisma. I also plan on getting the tier 2's to level 3.
Such training will take me just about a week more and my subscription will end. I then go for surgury so will set some really long skill to train before i go. maybe some tier 4-5 learning skill. or motion prediction or something..will have to decided 1-2 days before hand.
I do have some questions, people say bob requires you to fly certain fittings, where do i find these fittings?
I also have a ways to go as i want a jump clone so working up khandid navy faction. Doing so also gives me cash so i can afford to lose ships in 0.0 action.
Also means i get to stay in DSI who have been fantastic to me. I really wish some new people would start so i could do the same for others as has been done to me.
Once i get into the huricane i'll be asking for lots of advice, right now i'm looking at the "cheep level 4 runner" build for the huricane as a baseline for skills, but i will probably fit an armour tank and artilary with a salvager and tractor beam in the highslots. Target painter, and such in the mids.
Will be looking to make sure my support skills are up to par(the ones that help you but are not needed to pilot or fit the ship).
battle ships are looking sexy and after seeing 2 of them in action i can't help but want one. 8 high slots, 100m/s drone ability....awsome tank, just nt sure if i can take missing frigging frigates even more.
My rifter may have to be called in to rip em up..still love that ship. Zip zoom, pew pew.
I do decent dmg practically one shotting npc frigates....if i hit.
Even at range and w/ low transversal my scout artillary is missing a lot and i see "completly misses" a lot.
I have motion prediction 3 so i'll need to find out why i am missing so much. Never mind when they get closer and i attempt to orbit them at 515m/s. I do like the long range except for the missing bit. I think i'll stick with longer range as i here bob's out fit for the huricane is a ranged gank ship and that sits well with me.
I keep looking into command ships but i may train up Battle ships...or may just stay with the cane and go for tier 2 equipment on the cane. Aperently the cane can do level 4 missions, it's just not suggested and your tank will break so it take multiple runs. I'm okay with this. I also think i will like the cane for pvp. Lots of choices.
Right now though i am traing my learning skills, i plan to get all of the tier 1's to level 4 except charisma. I also plan on getting the tier 2's to level 3.
Such training will take me just about a week more and my subscription will end. I then go for surgury so will set some really long skill to train before i go. maybe some tier 4-5 learning skill. or motion prediction or something..will have to decided 1-2 days before hand.
I do have some questions, people say bob requires you to fly certain fittings, where do i find these fittings?
I also have a ways to go as i want a jump clone so working up khandid navy faction. Doing so also gives me cash so i can afford to lose ships in 0.0 action.
Also means i get to stay in DSI who have been fantastic to me. I really wish some new people would start so i could do the same for others as has been done to me.
Once i get into the huricane i'll be asking for lots of advice, right now i'm looking at the "cheep level 4 runner" build for the huricane as a baseline for skills, but i will probably fit an armour tank and artilary with a salvager and tractor beam in the highslots. Target painter, and such in the mids.
Will be looking to make sure my support skills are up to par(the ones that help you but are not needed to pilot or fit the ship).
battle ships are looking sexy and after seeing 2 of them in action i can't help but want one. 8 high slots, 100m/s drone ability....awsome tank, just nt sure if i can take missing frigging frigates even more.
My rifter may have to be called in to rip em up..still love that ship. Zip zoom, pew pew.
Morgal,
You are missing so much because artillery has HORRIBLE tracking speed. And medium arty will also have a tougher time hitting smaller targets, while having an easier time at bigger targets. Minmatar require a lot of gunnery skills to be trained to at least IV to be "really" effective.
With that being said, I love my minnie. Just keep up with the skill training and you will be on your way.
You are missing so much because artillery has HORRIBLE tracking speed. And medium arty will also have a tougher time hitting smaller targets, while having an easier time at bigger targets. Minmatar require a lot of gunnery skills to be trained to at least IV to be "really" effective.
With that being said, I love my minnie. Just keep up with the skill training and you will be on your way.
QUOTE(Reedak @ Feb 4 2009, 07:57 PM)
Morgal,
You are missing so much because artillery has HORRIBLE tracking speed. And medium arty will also have a tougher time hitting smaller targets, while having an easier time at bigger targets. Minmatar require a lot of gunnery skills to be trained to at least IV to be "really" effective.
With that being said, I love my minnie. Just keep up with the skill training and you will be on your way.
You are missing so much because artillery has HORRIBLE tracking speed. And medium arty will also have a tougher time hitting smaller targets, while having an easier time at bigger targets. Minmatar require a lot of gunnery skills to be trained to at least IV to be "really" effective.
With that being said, I love my minnie. Just keep up with the skill training and you will be on your way.
totally true. the rupture is more of a long range ship. the stabber however is like a rifter on steroids. fast and good with autocannons.
if youre using the rupture with artillery id highly recommend bringing drones with you, or a friend in a frig to help nail the smaller targets. also you could use m autocannons with a webber to help with hitting them. if you have the fitting space, you could also equip a tracking mod to help boost your tracking speeds. i use 2 on my bs and i can hit most things 15K or more away.
Ya right now the only thing i have helping me is a painter. I went with a painter over a webber as i can use it from farther away.
also out of curiosity what ammo are you using? different types of ammo have different rage properties which will alter your optimal range, thus affecting your ability to hit or mis.
example titanium is close range and will have trouble hitting outside of X distance. carbonized led is long range and doesnt hit as well with IN X range.
example titanium is close range and will have trouble hitting outside of X distance. carbonized led is long range and doesnt hit as well with IN X range.
Familiar with fall off and such think i am using EMP rounds as most of what a fight seems to be vulnerable to that.
Okay, well last night was my last night of play. I hope to be back by Monday at the very latest.
I have a fairly solid plan now.
I have a couple of leaning skills left before they are all at 4, so will work on those as well as battle cruisers 2.
From there i'll be getting some gunnery skills up so i can use a targeting computer. Battle cruisers 3 will also be done as it is fairly short.
This lets me out fit my Huricane reasonably well with a good set of support skills. I will go for motion prediction 4 if i can overnight as the next skills are not nearly so long term.
Drones...lots of drone skills. The increase in dps is amazing for these skills and they are very transferable. Also ups me from 3 heavies to 5 lights. takes me from about 19dps from drones to 80+ dps from the drones. This is alot for a 130dps ship(ya ya my skills suck).
Once thats done, more gunnery skills, Some more learning skills.
Once thats done i will probably go tier 2 for the huricane. While the battle ship looks nice with it's big guns and 100mbit/s drone's I think i'll like the huricane. We shall see.
Game wise i want to keep working up my faction for a jump clone. get some pvp action in or by then maybe some level 5's.
We shall see.
Oh i also plan on mimmnitar industrial for a hauler in there as i can.
I have a fairly solid plan now.
I have a couple of leaning skills left before they are all at 4, so will work on those as well as battle cruisers 2.
From there i'll be getting some gunnery skills up so i can use a targeting computer. Battle cruisers 3 will also be done as it is fairly short.
This lets me out fit my Huricane reasonably well with a good set of support skills. I will go for motion prediction 4 if i can overnight as the next skills are not nearly so long term.
Drones...lots of drone skills. The increase in dps is amazing for these skills and they are very transferable. Also ups me from 3 heavies to 5 lights. takes me from about 19dps from drones to 80+ dps from the drones. This is alot for a 130dps ship(ya ya my skills suck).
Once thats done, more gunnery skills, Some more learning skills.
Once thats done i will probably go tier 2 for the huricane. While the battle ship looks nice with it's big guns and 100mbit/s drone's I think i'll like the huricane. We shall see.
Game wise i want to keep working up my faction for a jump clone. get some pvp action in or by then maybe some level 5's.
We shall see.
Oh i also plan on mimmnitar industrial for a hauler in there as i can.
Surgery went well, hope to be back by monday
QUOTE(morgal @ Feb 12 2009, 08:26 PM)
Surgery went well, hope to be back by monday
good to hear.
Yep, glad to hear it. Now both Krishan and my alt Krisha can pull L4s for you to run in...
Well a bit of an update, back in game and running level 2 missions and am making decent isk on my own!!!
The mission bonus, bounty, loot, and salvage all adds up fairly nice. It does not compare to level 4's but, i am self sufficient which is worth more.
No big expenses coming up as i am training learning, drones then skills that improve what i am flying atm.
I am planning to go towards command ships rather than battle ships as the trip there looks more fun. So once my learning and combat skills are up to snuff and I am able to fit tier 2's on my hurricane i will look at assault ships and hac's. By this time i should have my khandid faction up to at least 8 so i will have a jump clone. This will enable me to do some pvp or 0.0 ratting missions or ops. I also hope the combat skills will enable my hurricane to more reliably run level 3's.
From there it's onto a command ship.
I also planned out about 400 days worth of stuff i eventually want to i can use eve mon to find the best attributes to stack. Looking like an int and perception heavy character will be best for what i have planned.
The mission bonus, bounty, loot, and salvage all adds up fairly nice. It does not compare to level 4's but, i am self sufficient which is worth more.
No big expenses coming up as i am training learning, drones then skills that improve what i am flying atm.
I am planning to go towards command ships rather than battle ships as the trip there looks more fun. So once my learning and combat skills are up to snuff and I am able to fit tier 2's on my hurricane i will look at assault ships and hac's. By this time i should have my khandid faction up to at least 8 so i will have a jump clone. This will enable me to do some pvp or 0.0 ratting missions or ops. I also hope the combat skills will enable my hurricane to more reliably run level 3's.
From there it's onto a command ship.
I also planned out about 400 days worth of stuff i eventually want to i can use eve mon to find the best attributes to stack. Looking like an int and perception heavy character will be best for what i have planned.
nice nice, sounds like solid planning coming together.
well bold plans for a character with only 1,750,000 skill points
Have to start somewhere.
QUOTE(morgal @ Feb 24 2009, 07:48 AM)
I also planned out about 400 days worth of stuff i eventually want to i can use eve mon to find the best attributes to stack. Looking like an int and perception heavy character will be best for what i have planned.
I don't know, man. Be careful in speccing on just two attributes. The only one that is reliably optional is CHA, and if you're going command ships and actually plan to train leadership/warfare module skills, even CHA isn't one you want to skimp on.
I've seen people with 28 in two attribs and the rest around 20 (with +4 implants). Personally, I've never once regretted having around 23 in every attribute. But I'm a JOAT, so...
Well i thought so as well and was going to stack all 4 as much as possible but.
even with some skills taking charisma and memory the secondary still takes the other and overall i save about a month of training by doing so.
you can do this yourself by having the plan and then using evemon's Implant tool. Take all your stats down to base level and play with them. you have 14 points to place where you like. I was very, very surprised by the results.
even with some skills taking charisma and memory the secondary still takes the other and overall i save about a month of training by doing so.
you can do this yourself by having the plan and then using evemon's Implant tool. Take all your stats down to base level and play with them. you have 14 points to place where you like. I was very, very surprised by the results.
DAMN DAMN DAMN DAMN
I need to remember "if you can't afford to lose it, don't fly it."
I lost my 100mil isk battle cruiser sized sized slavger with 3 salvage rigs.
I will rebuild but i will not combat salvage....i will rebuild because i am told it pays for it's self....but thats only true if you don't get some weird error where your warp bar is at full yet you can't warp.
Oh well. I'm back up to 40millionisk so i can buy another ship and out fit it but the riggs will take much much longer to afford.
Also had some SG officer in chan, and found out hac's where well used in pvp. So that makes me glad as that is what i am training towards.
But with a kid on the way i may be a miner because it means i can go afk.....
we shall see.
I need to remember "if you can't afford to lose it, don't fly it."
I lost my 100mil isk battle cruiser sized sized slavger with 3 salvage rigs.
I will rebuild but i will not combat salvage....i will rebuild because i am told it pays for it's self....but thats only true if you don't get some weird error where your warp bar is at full yet you can't warp.
Oh well. I'm back up to 40millionisk so i can buy another ship and out fit it but the riggs will take much much longer to afford.
Also had some SG officer in chan, and found out hac's where well used in pvp. So that makes me glad as that is what i am training towards.
But with a kid on the way i may be a miner because it means i can go afk.....
we shall see.
If you go miner, start now. To be effective in a Hulk is a 2-month+ train time, and only a hulk is truly an afk miner. Nothing else has the cargo hold to mine for 9-15min at time without filling up, yet still mine substantial amounts of ore.
Plus, the hulk also serves as a backup hauler. It holds 10500 with 2 rigs, and 17k with 2 rigs and 2 cargo hold expander IIs. A covetor is less than half that (and it is barely less training time to pilot a covetor over a hulk).
Plus, the hulk also serves as a backup hauler. It holds 10500 with 2 rigs, and 17k with 2 rigs and 2 cargo hold expander IIs. A covetor is less than half that (and it is barely less training time to pilot a covetor over a hulk).
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